what's the difference between panning and stereo width?

Discussion in 'Production' started by Person3, Sep 29, 2009.

  1. Person3

    Person3 New Member

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    Like if i duplicated a synth line into two tracks, panned one to the left and one to the right, is this the same as stereo width? They sound like they should be roughly the same but i'm sure they're not. Also what's the relevance of crossover frequencies in stereo width? I've just started fucking around with it but can't really hear massive differences in the sound...
     
  2. Dr_apocalipsis

    Dr_apocalipsis Dr_apocalipsis

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    No they are 2 separate parametres, inside a mixer (wether it's FL or Ableton or Qbase)
    there is a function for panning and a function for Sound spreading. You DON'T copy the synth, you manipulate the sound in the mixer.
     
  3. Dr_apocalipsis

    Dr_apocalipsis Dr_apocalipsis

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    Just as I said :

    The rule is - the higher frequency the sound - the more spreaded you have to put it. The lower the sound frequency - the closer to the middle it has to go.

    PS: Master Yoda my name is
     
  4. Person3

    Person3 New Member

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    ok cool but you only half answered my question. What's the difference between the two? i know there's a difference... Like if i'm dealing with a high frequency sound, why would i choose to spread the sound with stereo width rather than pan one part left and one part right?
     
  5. TongueFlap

    TongueFlap Flappin'

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    hello mate,


    Panning something to the left and something to the right will give you a good stereo image, if everything was sat in the middle it would sound pretty boring/less intersting (sound like mono). So your kinda on the right track if you were to do this. You can widen the image by using things like reverb, delays, a mono to stereo delay/reverb/phase/flanger etc. aslo you can get a stereo widener plugin, these push your sounds to the sides of the channels giving you a wider feel to your mix.
     
  6. TongueFlap

    TongueFlap Flappin'

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    this isint strictly true, what happens if you want to make a bass pan from left to right with automation?

    but... bass does tend to sit in the middle as a bass signal is mono - bass in stereo sounds abit odd.
     
  7. motion audio

    motion audio Active Member

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    Listen to this man, some good info there.

    Look at stereo width as a way of describing the sound you hear from a stereo speaker setup, its not so much a technique in itself, plug-ins that purely deal with stereo width will be doing combinations of other processing/effects to get their result.

    The idea of a crossover being used is just so that different processing can be applied to different frequencies in the same signal.
     
  8. TongueFlap

    TongueFlap Flappin'

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    also some good info :)

    there is lots of good info in mags like sound on sound, or books from amazon or something. mind you, i learnt most by trial and error
     
  9. Dr_apocalipsis

    Dr_apocalipsis Dr_apocalipsis

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    For the high pitches, in most cases you do want to spread them, but you must NEVER leave the middle empty.

    And if you want to make bass paning, putting it in the middle (Spreading) will not completely effect the panning function. It will still be able to pan, it's just the sound will be in the middle when the pan is tweaked in the middle. Kinda neat effect.
     
  10. TongueFlap

    TongueFlap Flappin'

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    I was on about a pan from hard left to hard right :)
     
  11. motion audio

    motion audio Active Member

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    If your going to play around with panning, be sure to keep checking your mixes in mono, as there can be cancelation effects when your mix is summed to mono making your hard work at the mixdown stage wasted.
     
  12. druu

    druu Member

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    Anyone know of any decent third party stereo width plugs? Ableton's Utility device is shithouse!
     
  13. TongueFlap

    TongueFlap Flappin'

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    i never use any mate, type in to google 'stereo width sound on sound' see if they have covered the issue
     
  14. Dr_apocalipsis

    Dr_apocalipsis Dr_apocalipsis

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    Well I used to use the "Rock AMP Legends VST" - in the effects tab it has this function right away.

    But I didn't find it practicle enough.
     
  15. DanDnB

    DanDnB Bass and Drums

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    Hey dudes,

    Yesterday I sat at the chair and worked on my new tune. I have two main basslines, one of them is slightely higher in freq, its sorta the 'growl' while the other is the 'grunt'.

    For the growl bassline, I did what you guys suggested. I broke up the frequencies into two seperate channels. One panned left and one panned right, it sounded strange, to say the least it only sounded better when the pan wasnt HARD, like 25% per side and thats it. Even then it was kinda weird, definately sounded OK, not terrible, but I dont remember hearing a phenomena like this in any real good DnB songs.

    Did I do this right?

    I basically pulled the frequencies at about 1k and up, they went right and 1k down went left. Should I pull the split to a lower freq? Like 250? Anything above 250 goes right all else goes left, etc??

    Someone please share this technique, it did sound interesting and I would like to incorporate it further into my choon.

    Thanks!
     
  16. Dr_apocalipsis

    Dr_apocalipsis Dr_apocalipsis

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    We need to hear your part with the baseline to be able to correct it - get yourself an account on DivShare.com and upload a freagment with your baseline - it will be the best way to help you.
     
  17. motion audio

    motion audio Active Member

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    I don't think anyones suggested that? Not panning the seperate frequencies to different sides, definately not with a bass.

    Might have been the crossover thing that confused you? You can benefit by processing different frequencies differently, for example a simple short reverb could brighten up the higher end of a drum loop/break, but cause problems for the low mid/low end.
     
  18. subprime

    subprime Dysjoint

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    If it sounds ok then try and use it, but this isn't what was suggested here (as far as I can tell)
    The lower frequencies should be centred, but you can mess around with the higher frequencies.

    Try something like low pass and centre on first channel.
    Duplicate your bass on two more channels and high pass somewhere around your low pass freq to create a crossover. Pan these two channels left and right (doesn't have to be hard pan)

    Now someone might tell me this is not right (cos I'm not an expert on phase cancellation and all that, but I been trying it).... you could add an effect
    to each channel but alter the setting slightly, like a slow phase or flange, chorus whatever with the rates slightly different.
    I tried this a few times, and it seemed to 'widen' the sound.
     
  19. kama

    kama benkama.net

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    Most stereo imaging plugins (and flangers, choruses etc.) work by delaying the other side just a little, maybe a millisecond's worth. This will make anything sound much more wide open and full, but there will usually be trouble when the sound is collapsed to mono when the sides start cancelling each other out. A mono sound system is rare nowadays but you'll never know... It's always a matter of choice.
     
  20. motion audio

    motion audio Active Member

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    Something loads of people overlook, well worth checking your mix in mono as your working, no point in putting it out if it'll only ever sound how you want in stereo

    Theres more systems than you'd think that works with it aswel, a lot of broadcasting stuff sends out mono, some club soundsystems etc.