tune mastering nightmare!

thedjnifty said:
From my understanding the only reason bass below a certain frequency has to be in mono is because it's almost impossible to cut to vinyl otherwise ... actually destroys the needle lol
Click to expand...

It'll make the needle skip if it's not centered below something around 150 and lower... I could be wrong on that number but it's around there.
 
kama said:
no it is actually closer to 300. cutting below 30 is just because it takes headroom from everything else but only a few systems can repeat the frequencies between 20-30.
Click to expand...

Is it that high? I thought it was in the 100s... anyhoot, about cutting 30 and below... I do a rolloff from 40down in Ozone... as it cleans up the bottom, takes care of any rogue low frequencies.
 
kama said:
Nah, you drive a hard conversation and I can appriceate someone who stands behind their views. I'm now sorry about the opening line of my last post but you seem to understand the point veiled behind the harsh words - from here it looks like you contradict yourself with your actions here: because as far as feedback and criticism are concerned, I've always regarded them as ways of bettering myself at whatever I do, instead of just asking for people's opinions and then disagreeing with them, as it seems to be the case with you (at least that what it looks like to me). Taking all that criticism in has sometimes been hard and has lead to major letdowns but in the end (i hope) I've learned something by it and evolved myself further.

It now seems we are very far from the original topic of mastering and we're starting to lead it to a direction where it's about the people rather than the matters at hand. For that I'm sorry but I still think that even in all your confidence and bravado you would gain a lot with a more humble mindset when it comes to music, especially your own. If you have something to reply I'll honour the argumentation and read it but I will not carry this conversation further to get the matter back on track.

PS. on the bomberman bass thing, why would you change it if it sounds good but looks bad on a spectrum view? I've never heard of anyone just listening to tunes by looking at a SA... IMO it's an urban myth that all bass has to be mono (and this might lead us back to the mastering topic with politically-correct-ninja-like guile). Only if it sounds bad when summed to mono it needs work, since some (most?) club systems have a bridged bass amp configuration that will sum to mono.
Click to expand...

No apologies necessary mate, I know I come off like an assface on the forum sometimes... believe me, I'm a nice guy and all of y'all sound like nice fellas (it's why I'm on this board).

This is true. I don't 'automatically' disagree with all feedback I receive... hell, I take suggestions on how a track should go 'direction wise' from my friends sometimes and I appreciate their insight. As far as volumes go, unless it's something I've completely missed: I'm usually pretty headstrong about DBs, I know where I want my elements to sit in the mix. Back in the day when I was still learning, yeah, hearing others advice was instrumental in helping me learn what good levels were.

Fair enough I apologize for rambling on and on, but I felt like I had to make my point known about Mastering tracks, and now that I've said my piece, I can be quiet about it : )))


As far as re rendering "Bomberman" because the Sub isn't perfectly centered... yeah, I hear you... it's not that it doesn't sound right, it's just the principle of the matter. I want it centered because it's the right thing to do. Each note is a half DB left, then right, then left, etc, etc.. and I don't like that. The Ear might not be able to pick it up, but a system would benefit a 'small' amount from having those notes hit dead center the way it was intended... it'll be a minor boost, but a boost in the quality of the tune nonetheless. And no, I don't "just listen to my tunes by looking at the SA" : )

Again, I was making another track and using the same Sub Patch that I'd used for the Sub on "Bomberman" when I realized that the Patch had some Pulse Width Modulation in effect that was causing it to alternate from slightly left to slightly right. Plus, I'm also doing a couple more misc edits on the tracks' Perc and I changed volumes on a couple hits.

I'm going to post it when it's rendered, but won't expect more feedback since the track is more or less the same. I feel like a bonehead for being such a stickler about 'making a track' but hey, that's how it goes for OCD individuals.


But back to the topic at hand, lol: bottom line, if one isn't sure about "mastering their own tune", then yes, they should look at having someone else to do it for them. If they feel like trying to learn the basics on their own (setting up a room, acquiring decent Monitors, buying a decent Software plug in for Mastering work, and having the patience to go through a lot of trial and error), then go for it, it's not impossible.

Everyone have a great weekend, cheers.
 
Damn, couldn't find it but I found this interview I've quoted in the past as well:

http://www.monolake.de/interviews/mastering.html


...Talking about cutting stuff to vinyl...
...so mono signals might cause slightly less problems. But there is a huge myth about that you can only cut bass in mono, that's something which is really resistantly in producer's heads, its absolutely not true!
I have been cutting several thousand of vinyls and I really have to think hard about when ever I had to cripple a stereo bass signal beyond musical recognition because it wasn't translatable to vinyl. That might be three cases, in all that years.

People should not bother about that, they should make the music the way they feel it should sound like!!!!
99% of problems related to phase can be corrected in the mastering room effortlessly without making a musical disaster out of the piece. With most phase adjustments that need to be done for vinyl, you can nicely live, and I never experienced somebody who was really shocked or totally unhappy with the result. Of course in the high days of IDM there were a couple of pieces that had 180 degrees out of phase full level 50 Hz sine waves and such, and that gives you problems...
Click to expand...
 
bloody hell!

no disrespect protoplasm, but thats far too many words for me to be bothered to reply to properly!

basically, your mixdown is key to good mastering. but good mastering on a good mixdown beats just a good mixdown imo (you cant polish a turd, but you can polish gold...), and to me, good mastering involves analogue equipment. because to me, analogue sounds better, without a doubt. analogue compressors and analogue tape please! and on top of that i want someone who is used to a mastering environment and knows how what he hears in that environment translates over to consumer systems. because i dont want to do that to be quite honest, i dont feel it is my job to do that, it is my job to get the sounds and balance sounding how i want, and more importantly, the creative elements, which is what interests me and the reason i got into making music. obviously i am going to be aware and interested in consistency, which is why i check my mixes on 2 sets of monitors, 2 sets of headphones, laptop and pc speakers, etc. but thats still not going to be enough really, i could spend all week listening to my tracks on different systems and in different environments and taking notes, but to be honest i haven't got the time, patience or motivation to do that.

of course theres no such thing as a perfect room, but you know what i mean, a well acoustically treated room to the degree that i certainly cant afford, and very few other bedroom producers can either.

this mastering engineer who started putting stereo effects on your mix sounds like a bit of a cowboy to me... if you want to get mastering done, stick with people who are revered and have a reputation: final tweak or simon @ the exchange, people like that. and if you are not happy with the master afterwards, give it back! say its wrong!

anyway, its clear we have quite different opinions on this so further arguing is essentially pointless, so we will have to agree to disagree!
 
glennyb said:
bloody hell!

no disrespect protoplasm, but thats far too many words for me to be bothered to reply to properly!

basically, your mixdown is key to good mastering. but good mastering on a good mixdown beats just a good mixdown imo (you cant polish a turd, but you can polish gold...), and to me, good mastering involves analogue equipment. because to me, analogue sounds better, without a doubt. analogue compressors and analogue tape please! and on top of that i want someone who is used to a mastering environment and knows how what he hears in that environment translates over to consumer systems. because i dont want to do that to be quite honest, i dont feel it is my job to do that, it is my job to get the sounds and balance sounding how i want, and more importantly, the creative elements, which is what interests me and the reason i got into making music. obviously i am going to be aware and interested in consistency, which is why i check my mixes on 2 sets of monitors, 2 sets of headphones, laptop and pc speakers, etc. but thats still not going to be enough really, i could spend all week listening to my tracks on different systems and in different environments and taking notes, but to be honest i haven't got the time, patience or motivation to do that.

of course theres no such thing as a perfect room, but you know what i mean, a well acoustically treated room to the degree that i certainly cant afford, and very few other bedroom producers can either.

this mastering engineer who started putting stereo effects on your mix sounds like a bit of a cowboy to me... if you want to get mastering done, stick with people who are revered and have a reputation: final tweak or simon @ the exchange, people like that. and if you are not happy with the master afterwards, give it back! say its wrong!

anyway, its clear we have quite different opinions on this so further arguing is essentially pointless, so we will have to agree to disagree!
Click to expand...

Yuppers... Cheers mate... to each his own.

The idea of adding noise to my hard work at the end of the process sounds like a gash idea, but hey, if you enjoy that sound, go for it!

Keep making Jams, I look forward to seeing your work available as 320s someday... I'll definitely support them if I see them at Addictech.com!
 
Protoplasym said:
Yuppers... Cheers mate... to each his own.

The idea of adding noise to my hard work at the end of the process sounds like a gash idea, but hey, if you enjoy that sound, go for it!

Keep making Jams, I look forward to seeing your work available as 320s someday... I'll definitely support them if I see them at Addictech.com!
Click to expand...

i fucking love noise! lovely warm noise!

cheers btw dude! hopefully something coming soon, when dubsaw man is online next im gonna moan and find out what the hell is going on! segfault is available on beatport though - https://www.beatport.com/en-US/html...ber=1&resultsPerPage=15#app=1b95&a486-index=0 (second one along)
 
glennyb said:
i fucking love noise! lovely warm noise!

cheers btw dude! hopefully something coming soon, when dubsaw man is online next im gonna moan and find out what the hell is going on! segfault is available on beatport though - https://www.beatport.com/en-US/html...ber=1&resultsPerPage=15#app=1b95&a486-index=0 (second one along)
Click to expand...

Dang... I hope Addictech gets your tunes at some point.. I can't support Beatport, they pissed me off a long time ago and will never get my business.

The only noise I enjoy is from Vinyl. I hate noise in my Prod. Case in point, I have hundreds of tunes that need to be ported over from my various pieces of kit and I'm waiting until I build a new machine with a Sound Card that has a really low A-D input. My Delta 44 has a Noise Floor of -75 DB which is unacceptable for Prod.

But, lol.. to be honest: I know that noise is a part of this music... I wouldn't be surprised if more than half of my vinyl collection utilized Analog gear in the construction of that music. It's just something I personally want to steer clear of.


g/l with the releases!
 
Back
Top Bottom