The Future for The DJ - Will vinyl survive the Digital DJ evolution?

Discussion in 'Drum & Bass' started by mps1210, Apr 8, 2009.

  1. mps1210

    mps1210 New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2009
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
    Will vinyl remain as the most popular music format for modern Drum 'n' Bass Club DJs?

    :confused:

    As part of my degree I have decided to investigate the sustainability of vinyl within the drum 'n' bass scene. With over 600 drum n bass tunes on vinyl, I have spent my youth DJ'ing, collecting vinyl’s and buying into the Drum 'n' Bass scene.

    But I am now a broke lazy student with less money to spend on records, and with the availability of Digital music, I am now a Traktor Scratch user and find that most of the tunes I want are available to download at a fraction of the cost of vinyl.

    For me vinyl is no longer such a big deal, and unless I start playing out regularly and get on mailing lists, release my own music or somehow find the desire to spend more money on vinyl again, ill most likely stick with Digital.

    But id like to here from you, I know this topic has been discussed in depth across the forums, but for the purposes of my study I have made up my own questionnaire.

    If you could spare a little of your time then please answer the questions below and let me know your views on this subject.

    Much Respect.


    The evolution of Club DJ Technologies – Will Vinyl Survive?

    Digital VS Vinyl

    1. Has the introduction of new digital formats and technology had any significant impact on the sale, distribution and availability of vinyl?




    2. Would you consider that the new digital formats threaten to take over vinyl in terms of sales, use and widespread popularity?



    Vinyl Popularity


    3. Would you consider that the vinyl record is still the most popular format for Club DJs, judging by sales, usage, and your own personal opinion?




    Reaching your customer / audience

    4. If you release your own music, do you sell in vinyl, MP3 or CD, or a mixture of the three?






    It’s All About The Sound

    5. Do you think that vinyl sounds better than its rival digital formats, such as CD or MP3, and why?









    6. Do you believe that the Digital formats will ever be able to replicate the sound of vinyl (For example Digital vinyl emulation)





    Is the Turntable Paramount?


    7. Do you see the turntable as an integral tool to the DJ, or could it be replaced with something new, and allow the DJ tag/status to remain?






    8. Is the Technics Sl1200/Sl1210 turntable still the industry standard?






    9. Do you foresee the turntable ever being replaced completely with an alternative technology, such as a new type of Digital turntable with more advanced features?





    10. If a new Digital Technics SL turntable, with Hybrid advanced Digital CD, vinyl MP3 control and traditional Technics analog turntable technology was released, would this interest you? (Think of this as a Technics SL1210, with a CD slot that works as a controller for the CD and MP3 software – that functions the same as a 1210)



    Digital Credibility

    11. Do you see Digital based DJs as being any more or less credible than those who use entirely or partly vinyl records?





    12. Do you consider being a Digital DJ easier than an analog turntable DJ?





    13. Do you consider Digital aids such as bpm counters, auto beat matching, key lock and sync features as aids for extra creativity or as a cheat for a DJ?
     
  2. DJ NUERA

    DJ NUERA 5HEAD

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2008
    Messages:
    6,531
    Likes Received:
    168
    Location:
    CRANIUM
    1. Has the introduction of new digital formats and technology had any significant impact on the sale, distribution and availability of vinyl?
    In my opinion there are probably more people downloading music now than buying vinyl as it is more accessible and cheaper, and available to everyone at the click of just a few buttons Eg. No shipping costs, no cost of having to travel to pick up records etc, but saying that I know a lot of people (including myself) that still buy lots of vinyl

    2. Would you consider that the new digital formats threaten to take over vinyl in terms of sales, use and widespread popularity?
    Not as long as the people who are buying vinyl now stay with it, I think you will always find turntables in every club you go to, and as long as people still enjoy buying vinyl then hopefully it will stay alive.

    Vinyl Popularity

    3. Would you consider that the vinyl record is still the most popular format for Club DJs, judging by sales, usage, and your own personal opinion?
    in my own personal opinion I would say yes, I use nothing but vinyl as that’s what feels good for me.

    Reaching your customer / audience

    4. If you release your own music, do you sell in vinyl, MP3 or CD, or a mixture of the three?
    Don’t release but if I did I would probably do a mixture of all 3 as its not always DJ’s that want the tune.
    It’s All About The Sound

    5. Do you think that vinyl sounds better than its rival digital formats, such as CD or MP3, and why?
    In some cases yes, but if you have an old battered vinyl that you have rinsed a million times it may sound a bit sketchy. But nothing beats the sound of crackling vinyl.

    6. Do you believe that the Digital formats will ever be able to replicate the sound of vinyl (For example Digital vinyl emulation)
    Its possible, with technology advancing at the speed it is now then im sure someone will be able to replicate it.

    Is the Turntable Paramount?

    7. Do you see the turntable as an integral tool to the DJ, or could it be replaced with something new, and allow the DJ tag/status to remain?
    I don’t think you can call yourself a DJ if you don’t own a turntable, and it is THE most integral tool.

    8. Is the Technics Sl1200/Sl1210 turntable still the industry standard?
    Yes

    9. Do you foresee the turntable ever being replaced completely with an alternative technology, such as a new type of Digital turntable with more advanced features?
    I can see the turntables with advanced features being released but never replacing the turntable
    10. If a new Digital Technics SL turntable, with Hybrid advanced Digital CD, vinyl MP3 control and traditional Technics analog turntable technology was released, would this interest you? (Think of this as a Technics SL1210, with a CD slot that works as a controller for the CD and MP3 software – that functions the same as a 1210)
    I wouldn’t go out of my way to buy it, as I would imagine it would be quite expensive, id rather spend it on MK5 G’s

    Digital Credibility

    11. Do you see Digital based DJs as being any more or less credible than those who use entirely or partly vinyl records?
    No, but Id much prefer to see a DJ use vinyl as in my opinion it is easier on CD decks and it takes the fun out of it for me.

    12. Do you consider being a Digital DJ easier than an analog turntable DJ?
    Yes

    13. Do you consider Digital aids such as bpm counters, auto beat matching, key lock and sync features as aids for extra creativity or as a cheat for a DJ?
    Takes all the fun out of it, if you put auto beat match in front of a chimp they could rock a crowd for 2 hours with flawless mixing, seems pointless to me.


    Safe good questionare
     
  3. jimchizz

    jimchizz Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2007
    Messages:
    285
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Bromley
    I've just finished my 10,000 word dissertation on this mate, taken me long but it looks good put together. my tutor at uni wrote "state of bass" if you can find a copy of that in your library itll be useful, also look at simon reynolds - energy flash, and sarah thorntons - club cultures. all useful sources with decent theoretical and cultural methodologies into it.
     
  4. Wellsy

    Wellsy Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2007
    Messages:
    937
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Cardiff
    1. Has the introduction of new digital formats and technology had any significant impact on the sale, distribution and availability of vinyl?

    Well obviously its had an impact on vinyl sales but vinyl is still readily available, if not more than digital formats as you cant buy single mp3s in shops, although im sure in the near future many stores will.


    2. Would you consider that the new digital formats threaten to take over vinyl in terms of sales, use and widespread popularity?

    I do think they are a threat, but more so in other dance music, not so much d&b.


    Vinyl Popularity


    3. Would you consider that the vinyl record is still the most popular format for Club DJs, judging by sales, usage, and your own personal opinion?

    In the d&b scene I would say viynl is most popular


    Reaching your customer / audience

    4. If you release your own music, do you sell in vinyl, MP3 or CD, or a mixture of the three?

    I would choose cheapest manufacturing cost's hehe



    It’s All About The Sound

    5. Do you think that vinyl sounds better than its rival digital formats, such as CD or MP3, and why?

    Theres plenty of arguments for and against .Heres some very brief statements:

    Vinyl is analog and the frequency range is much broader but can be prone to noise.

    Digital formats can reject noise and distortions when it is been converted from analog to digital resulting in a crispier and cleaner sound.

    I suppose vinyl does sound better with bassey type music like dub and d&b due to its warm sound,but with electronic type music, digital owns.





    6. Do you believe that the Digital formats will ever be able to replicate the sound of vinyl (For example Digital vinyl emulation)

    Yes ovcourse, there are various ways to replicate those frequencies found with analog sounds.



    Is the Turntable Paramount?


    7. Do you see the turntable as an integral tool to the DJ, or could it be replaced with something new, and allow the DJ tag/status to remain?

    There will be different impressions with what you use definaltey, im sure alot of people will hate it if a dj has just some sort of mixing pad totally alien to that of a set of turntables, but as long as the dj is still using a good amount of skill and performance then theres nothing wrong with that.




    8. Is the Technics Sl1200/Sl1210 turntable still the industry standard?

    Erm most industries I believe?





    9. Do you foresee the turntable ever being replaced completely with an alternative technology, such as a new type of Digital turntable with more advanced features?

    It already has, not quite ready to completely over take analog turntables though.



    10. If a new Digital Technics SL turntable, with Hybrid advanced Digital CD, vinyl MP3 control and traditional Technics analog turntable technology was released, would this interest you? (Think of this as a Technics SL1210, with a CD slot that works as a controller for the CD and MP3 software – that functions the same as a 1210)

    Yes think their fantastic pieces of technology.

    Digital Credibility

    11. Do you see Digital based DJs as being any more or less credible than those who use entirely or partly vinyl records?

    Should have same creditability, dependent on hardware/sofware use of course



    12. Do you consider being a Digital DJ easier than an analog turntable DJ?

    Not at all, if its automated then yes but I disagree.



    13. Do you consider Digital aids such as bpm counters, auto beat matching, key lock and sync features as aids for extra creativity or as a cheat for a DJ?[/QUOTE]

    Cheating of course, although fair do's if you use the bpms counters to mix as their terrible lol
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2009
  5. mps1210

    mps1210 New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2009
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
    :not_worth

    Cheers for this guys, your comments will help me greatly in backing up my own thoughts and ideas on this subject.

    It’s a very debatable, subjective and opinionated topic to cover with no real black or white answers to any of the areas I have looked into.

    I find that it all depends on the DJs, producers and people within the scenes that ultimately influence consumer behavior and also the mindset and attitude of those wanting to get into the scene.

    My theory is that the next generation of DJs (i.e the kids growing up in the next 10 years or so who get into DJ'ing) will most likely choose digital as it’s what they grow up with. Plus with the growing number of DJs using digital based technology - the influence from people in the scene will have its effect.

    I think that if I was like 14 again getting into dnb, buying into it all, aspiring to be a DJ, then I would probably look up to the new digital performance DJ side of things more so, as it seems there is much more opportunity for development and creativity within the mix – Although it seems that within drum n bass there are not many people embracing it as much as within other genres like electro and so forth. I think it’s only a matter of time before we see more dnb DJs doing super creative things with new digital based technologies. Once this happens, and the big guys are doing it, essentially many will follow.

    Imagine having exclusive mix/set deals with DJs, artists and record labels in the scene whereby you have a project file (such as Ableton Live or some other type of program) which has the track in it that you can basically perform and remix - mix into other tunes live as a performer/ DJ.

    Plus with Serato announcing a partnership with Ableton Live, you would be able to use your turntable to control the audio, like mixing in the traditional way, but say mixing just the lead lines, scratching the vocals in on their own with other tunes. Imagine being able to mix, scratch and apply effects to any individual sample or sound within a production. Plus do all this using turntables as well as MIDI controllers and CDJs.

    Of course this is where you go from being a traditional DJ into something more. A producer, performer, live mashup jock whatever it ends up being commonly branded.

    But this is nothing new as such. Because most DJs I’ve looked up to, weren’t just DJs. They are producers, audio engineers and remixers. DJ'ing is just there way of performing, as the music they play was never appropriate for performance in any other way other than DJ’ing and mixing. But lets face it, all your really doing is playing pre recorded music, in time. Yes there is skill involved, it isn’t easy. But these DJs do a whole lot more than that when you take into consideration the production, audio engineering and remixing etc.

    But now, with the way things are heading. You can now mix/play/perform your productions in more intuitive, technical and musician like ways, and still be within the DJ realm. - Therefore bringing the studio to the DJ/performance stage.

    Of course Pendulum are the main guys who have done this and pulled it off into the mainstream (arguably selling out and toning down for the commercial market) and of course London Elektricity, and New Zealand’s Shapeshifter have put drum n bass into a live electronic and acoustic performing, touring band . But this is just the start of the race for the next breed of live real time performance lead DJS.

    Of course to get to the level of these guys is far more than just making beats. But with the technology that is on offer, you can essentially add more performance skills into your mix, and develop more as a producer and a DJ, as well as a musician.

    I think there will be a definite line drawn between performing producer and traditional DJ. Just image Andy C performing his style of mixing live, but running his and other peoples actual tracks in real time, bringing in elements of tracks and double dropping as he does, but with the ability to manipulate not just the vinyl record and the track in its entirety, but individual elements and segments with each track.

    With the power of computers and the technology that’s surfacing, this is more or less ready to be rolled out right now. Plus most the big DJs know how to use the gear already from the studio side of things so it’s like just a matter of time really.

    I see it as you’ll have your DJ’s playing your gigs as normal - Traditional vinyl, CDJ whatever, same old same old. But it will become commonplace to have live producer/performer DJ’s at many more events. It’s already happened on a small scale, but mainly for the big festivals and raves. Pendulum played live, in the early days not as a band but with exactly the sort of stuff I’m talking about, but then they started the band and went from there (technology being one of the governing factors for getting the band off the ground).

    But for me the band context is also different. A band is a band, what I see is like your standard producing DJs being able to do stuff solo or Back2Back, not playing lots of electronic instruments and MIDI instruments all at the same time, but manipulating there sets with controllers. Think MIDI, vinyl control and the usual mixer setup with the FX. Being able to play out with your own productions and others if you can get your hands on the files in a more LIVE, less restricted way.

    Check out Allen and Heath Xone 4D mixers, the Pioneer DJM-800 with MIDI control and the new stuff from Native Instruments such as Traktor Pro / Duo, Machine and the like. There are lots of things like this on the market or due to hit the market at much more budget prices too.

    It’s complicated stuff, but once more DJ’s within drum ’n’ bass start pulling this off. There will be big tings a gwan.

    :D
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2009