My last Sub bass Question i promise!!!

Discussion in 'Production' started by Soundicidal, Oct 12, 2010.

  1. Soundicidal

    Soundicidal New Member

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    well i have a couple questions....
    what would be the lowest setting for your lowpass in hz (if u normally low pass your subs). what is the highest (in hz) you would high pass your subs. i usually stick around 30-40hz depending on low end.
    dynamically speaking, how should my sub bass look on an oscilloscope, really dynamic or not so dynamic? when i listen to most pro tracks i feel that there's some movement or fluctuation in the sub bass, i don't think it's side chaining though. And in theory i would think that if sub bass should have no dynamics then how are they getting this modulation? what about those sub basses that sound like a long 808 kick, its got some kind of attack to it? and if my sub is supposed to have dynamics, i can't figure out how to not compete with the kick.
    Now other fx, usually i just use voxengo tube amp with the LFP para set to about 60-70ish, BIAS i have no clue what that means (ill try google) so i just leave it at 50 or halfway. And the Drive i set around the halfway range as well depending on sub bass. i don't touch any other settings cause i don't know what oversampling is. I guess i wanna believe that theres a general rule of thumb to mixing sub bass in dnb, i mean how hard can this be. i feel i'm over-complicating it.
    any suggestions? i know i'm rambling. peas
     
  2. subprime

    subprime Dysjoint

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    adding some dynamics to the tail of the sub won't affect whether or not it clashes with the kick frequency wise, if that's what you mean.
     
  3. T Leaf

    T Leaf Neighbourhood Sickhead

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    what music do you make?
     
  4. RUSSLA

    RUSSLA DNBF Monarch

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    Worth sticking a mastered track into your DAW and looking at the analyzer to see what that does.. Then maybe cut the highs down gradually and just focus on where the sub and kicks begin?
     
  5. Soundicidal

    Soundicidal New Member

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    well i produce dnb im going for the more gritty side of dnb (noisia limewax etc) just trying to get a thread going on some general settings one would use for sub bass (fx highpass lowpass limiting n such). i feel its hard to hear exactly what the subs are doing in a proper mix sometimes especially with this type of dnb. everything is saturated or distorted it seems. used a reference yesterday though and it made a huge difference i think. love tube amps!!

    http://soundcloud.com/soundicidal
     
  6. Krispy

    Krispy Member

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    I usually low pass around 80hz with a slight 1-2db boost around 55-60hz and sidechain the kick (usually)
     
  7. logikz

    logikz I Am Not The King Staff Member

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    to me its like the sub and the kick, that balance, to get that right, i had to find a couple of subs that i use for all my tunes,
    and then a regiment of kicks i know work on top of that.
    so sample selection first, then pitch and volume, and then eq and compression and whatnot. i find sidechaining fun for the aesthetic, i should do more with that come to think of it
     
  8. T Leaf

    T Leaf Neighbourhood Sickhead

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    yeh with noisia they deffinately duck their bass from kicks. I'f i was making a noisia bas (which is very difficult and i have never succeeded fully) i'd probably use a lowpassed pulse for the sub and then make the twisting mid - hi layer,
    channel 1 - sub (mono this from 150hz down to 35hz) (no master output)
    channel 2 - mid-hi (effect this how you want it to change notching, band passing whatever - play time!) (no master output)
    channel 3 - put the sub and mid-hi in together, as they both need effecting by side-chaining the kick (master output)
    channel 4 - kick for side chaining autonomy, you can also use a snare or a hat that doesnt get send to master for really sharp ducks that you can barely hear but work (master output)
    bang some bass out and let us hear it to help further :)

    hope this is of relevance?
     
  9. Krispy

    Krispy Member

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    Hey do you mean you would be routing things to make these channels? I'm just a bit confused by how you are putting them all together. Like in Channel 3 for example, will you be sending the sub and mid-hi to this channel together in order to affect them differently?

    ALso, by no master output on channel 1 and 2, basically the only output from these 2 channels will be after they are combined into channel 3?

    Just trying to understand your idea :)


    EDIT: K i read this a bunch of times and it makes sense now, but couldn't you just skip the channel 3 step and apply sidechain-compression to channel 1 and 2 individually instead of combining them??
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2010
  10. T Leaf

    T Leaf Neighbourhood Sickhead

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    ah sorry man this is why i hardly try and help! lol let me try and clear it up :D

    ok you got the part about the outputs correct, 1 and 2 cant be heard until they are in channel 3. Channel 3 is there purely so you can link the volumn of both sub and mid-hi to the peaking of the kick.
    So when the kick hits in channel 4 - it triggers a reduction in channel 3 creating that sucking sound. is that better explained? if not i will try and to a screen print of FL Studio
     
  11. Krispy

    Krispy Member

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    I think combining them like that would be a step that I would want to do near the final stages of production, maybe during the mixdown. I would want to make sure I had the levels and EQing of each sitting just right in the tune before putting into 1 channel together
     
  12. T Leaf

    T Leaf Neighbourhood Sickhead

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    yeh fair call krispy each to their own on that one
     
  13. sam the dnb man

    sam the dnb man Variation

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    I lowpass(hi cut) at 100 HZ.
    I sidechain the kick with the Sub depending on the type of drums I use.
     
  14. Neomind

    Neomind Too many skulls!">:O

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    Btw cheers on the "gritty" liking ;)

    well, here's my 2 cents.

    If I ever have a stand-alone subbass (a sine wave) I always lowpass it at 100hz -12b of reduction filter.

    But the truth is that I never make a new synth or have a subbass on its side. I just get my bass, reese, 808, or whatever and split it into 2 after some FX (say some distortion), and that lower split freq (I usually split at 300-500hz so the higher part gets high passed at that freq) the lower freqs split get compressed/limited to fuck and sometimes boosted if needed. This way you get a much more defined sub that goes in harmony with your bass or reese.

    And, unless I have a VERY LONG BASSY kick, or the kick is in inverted phase with the sub (which is 90% of the time so hard, should be same note and 1/2 of the sub period), I never sidechain my sub to the kick cause all in all the bassy kick will add to the sub and make these sub freqs even higher.
     
  15. kama

    kama benkama.net

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    I rarely lowpass or highpass subs. Maybe when I try to make a sub out of a reece or something I might lowpass, which is a nice way to get some movement and life into it. But simple sine subs that I mostly use (like that 808 kick for example) dont really need any EQing. There's nothing going in it that needs removing. A sine wave is just that, a single frequency. If you apply EQ/filter to it, you'll just make some notes quieter, it doesnt affect the timbre of the sound in any way. Tho an 808 bass has some mids in it, that pop in the start is a pitch envelope coming down a few octaves.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2010
  16. T Leaf

    T Leaf Neighbourhood Sickhead

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    good point raised by kama, but i use a 3osc generator sine which for some reason picks up some DC offset from somewhere in my setup, i have to *high* cut to make the wave centered properly
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2010
  17. Nacon

    Nacon Vidual

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    why the crap would you use 3 osc's for a sine wave, that's just adding more sines to it.. and making it louder.
    Just use 1 osc, switch it to sine, play a low note... and you've just gotten rid of all the hassle... Simple.
     
  18. T Leaf

    T Leaf Neighbourhood Sickhead

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    i only use one of the osc's in 3osc. the hassle isnt from my 3osc the hassle seems to come from somewhere else. but it aibt really any hassle for me. cheers though nacon
     
  19. logikz

    logikz I Am Not The King Staff Member

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    because on the 3xosc you can detune the sub and thats just one example of the fun you can have with more than one osc. need to get out that old box nacon hm
     
  20. T Leaf

    T Leaf Neighbourhood Sickhead

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    also you can create your own waveform oscs and then use them in 3osc :D