Mixing Down....

Discussion in 'Production' started by CH3SH, Feb 17, 2010.

  1. CH3SH

    CH3SH CH3SH - Naphalm Audio

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    So at a gander im jus looking for universal info,
    How much does everyone mix down there bounces/processing too?

    Usually i goto -3db
    But recently iv been suggested to push it to -8db
    Hmmmm and i though -6db was tops lol
     
  2. kama

    kama benkama.net

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    master peakin at -6 to -3 usually.

    I dont pay attention to it that much tho, as long as it's a good range below 0 I'm happy.
     
  3. the-rippa

    the-rippa I'll Kill You Bastard !!!

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    I sent a tune to get mastered a while ago and the engineer told me in advance to leave at least -3db of headroom .

    Thats what i tend to stick to before export.
     
  4. ARTFX

    ARTFX www.artfx-studios.com

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    -3db should be okay.
    At least let it stay beneath 0db.
     
  5. DJPancake

    DJPancake NEW NAME IS DJ INCLINED

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    the-rippa,

    in Reason what are you using for that final "mastering suite" combinator?

    I've been using the default then adding a second above it using the "8-band parallel compression" patch. Dave from boyinaband.com said to do this in one of his videos, and its been sounding really nice. Just want to know what everyone else is using?
     
  6. glennyb

    glennyb Member

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    as long as you are using 24 bit then you can go pretty damn low without any noticable quality degradation. apparently -6 - -3 is the best range to be in, but a little bit either way shouldnt hurt.
     
  7. the-rippa

    the-rippa I'll Kill You Bastard !!!

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    Hi,

    Im dave from boyinaband.com..... (god that voice)

    Anyway....

    I tend to steer clear of all this mastering in Reason stuff, it gives me nothing but a headache. Try and focus on gettin ya mixdown sounding the best it possibly can then if you wanna have a go at mastering ya tune fine but i prefer to let someone else do all it, i aint no where near ready for all that...

    I wrote an email to Dub Studio and asked some question's relating to the mixdown, mono-ing bass for cutting purposes etc and here's the reply i got.

    "Thank you for your questions, this is the sort of thing that we like here at the Dubstudio.

    Hopefully i can explain in full detail, why everyone talks about the below points (and our stance on them)

    1. If the subbass is too loud in one channel (left for example) then that can make the Cutting needle cross over into the next groove causing a skip, also as SubBass frequencies are omnipresent (they don't sound like they are coming from any direction...but from everywhere) there is no need to pan the Sub.

    We will look at that when we cut the record and adjust accordingly, but it can sound better if you just make sure that you don't have any sub bass coming out of just one channel....(try monoing your mix and see if the bass drops in volume..if it does then you have problems and maybe try and mono the Sub)

    2. EQing and Compression. You say that you use Reason 4 and are adding EQing and compression on individual sounds in the mix...this is fine, keep the eq's and compressors on.

    What everyone is talking about is putting a compressor and EQ on the Final Mix (master channel) you do not what to do this as effectivly you are mastering the track and when we try and maser it it can sound like its been mastered twice.

    If you do have Plugins on the master channel, and when you take them off your mix sounds rubbish, then it may be your mix that needs looking at and you should try mixing without anything on the master channel (it can be rather enlightening!!!)

    3. You should not worry about the overall level of your track (unless its REALLY quiet) as this is where we step in......We use some of the best outboard equipment and ITB Plugins around combined with more than 15 years of production and Mastering experience to rase the level in a controlled manor so it sounds as good as it can when cut onto Dubplate (we can also provide the 24Bit WAV/AIFF files for you to convert to Mp3 and send out if needed...please ask about this service)

    what you are using to make the track louder (Mclass tools) can be helpful if you are sending your track as a digital file to a DJ (mp3 for example) as you need to make sure that it meets the same spec (level, bass, tops ect...) as everythnig else out there...BUT when cutting to vinyl, please give us the un-processes files with some headroom for us to do our thing...

    so to sum up...

    1. Don't switch off ALL your processing, just anything that is over the WHOLE MIX

    2. Don't worry about level (if you think it needs it...try remixing..a great mix will always make a great master)

    3. If you wanted the 24Bit WAV files we can also supply at cost...

    I hope this helps and if you wanted to discuss anything further, please do not hesitate to ask
    "

    SORTED....
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2010
    Thin and crispy, DJPancake and CH3SH like this.
  8. DJPancake

    DJPancake NEW NAME IS DJ INCLINED

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    wow, thank you very much for sharing that! (plus rep.)

    When i don't have anything set as the "mastering suite" it sounds awfully weak, then when i turn on the 8 Band-parallel-compression it sounds real nice. When i first got Reason i experimented with master compression, and it sounded awful, almost like those early Headhunters songs with the low threshold.

    Im not sure if i'll ever get a dance/dn'b tune mastered, as i just want to play live at clubs for fun, but my buddy and i are starting a two man rap group. (im and awful rapper, so im doing the instrumentals) So i suppose i should go on to a rap forum. lol

    thanks
     
  9. the-rippa

    the-rippa I'll Kill You Bastard !!!

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    No problem mate.

    Thats what this forum is about, sharing the wealth if ya get me.....

    I was the same mate thinkin i aint ever gonna shit mastered but the more u progress with ya music & especially if your DJ-in live somewhere DO IT !!!!

    When ya get YOUR tunes mastered & cut to vinyl an play somewhere ya never know who's listenin'......

    Maybe that will be your lucky break ?????
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2010
  10. RevTech

    RevTech Butthole=output transduce

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    I know I'm shit at mixdowns and I make my master peak at -0 so that probably isn't good enough. I should go to -3 then, but thing is, on the master I have izotope ozone running and I have a feeling it's clipping my signal, I should look into it.
     
  11. vickvega

    vickvega Mr. Blonde

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    we are usually down about -4/-5 db and seems to werk out goodies for us but it all varies
     
  12. groelle

    groelle Well-Known Member

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    i for my part, really dunno what that is about tbh. whats the difference in peaking at -3 or at 0? the mastering engineer WILL make it louder, i know that they literally cant go above 0 db, but they DO so. if i import a mastered tune into my daw, it WILL peak at + db, so why in gods name should i leave headroom if the barrier is imaginary?!

    and apart from that, i dont got a label, hence why i wont get my tunes mastered. and even if i got one, i could just turn the master output down. dunno how this should affect my mix or my sound in the slightest, or how it could be better when directly mixed to -3db (that said, i dont really use that much compression to gain volume).

    in the meantime, while im learning more and more about music production, im mixing as loud as possible (sometimes even in the + marks..) with an limiter absorbing the peaks and avoiding digital clipping. works a treat if you ask me (you can listen to me and a mates latest tunes on our soundcloud, its in my sig).

    my two pennies. and if anyone could give me a founded, scientific reason, why i should mix down at -3 or even -6 db, id be very thankful. (think i wont change my workflow tho xD)
     
  13. Freek

    Freek Lets get freeeeeeky

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    I mixdown my tunes to about -3db then export as WAV, then create a new project and bring the volume up, eq & limit so that it sits on roughly 0db then export mp3. That way if i send a tune to be proffessionally mastered then the wav is already at the right volume.
     
  14. kama

    kama benkama.net

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    Same here. I export mixdowns at where ever they happen to land between -8 and -1 at max, then do a little home mastering job only for the demo/promo purpose mp3, where I EQ, compress, sometimes saturate, and limit it to a gain reduction of maybe -2db at most. RMS would be from -13 to -11 on that. To me it's important to sit on the tune (and not to listen to it) for about a week before trying to master it, to get sort of a fresh viewpoint to it. At that point you can usually spot some other problems easier as well.
     
  15. Freek

    Freek Lets get freeeeeeky

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    Id never thought of this you know, im gonna give this ago from now on, i imagine it will make a lot of difference. nice one mate
     
  16. padders

    padders Member

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    I have only recently started to have a proper go at mixdowns. Before I tended to try and do it as I went along. However recently i have been following some tutrials on audio tuts amongst other things and have been really pleased with the results.
    http://audio.tutsplus.com/category/tutorials/mixing-mastering/

    How i go about it now:
    I set every element to -12 db.
    Then I Eq'ed every element.
    Checked them on s(m)exoscope to ckeck elements wearn't spiking everywhere.
    and drew them onto a peice of paper as shown here.
    http://audio.tutsplus.com/tutorials/mixing-mastering/3d-mixing-part-2-panorama/ (scroll about half way down.)
    i did some panning so that some elemnts didnt clash. But kept the main elements in the centre.
    I then listened to the song at meduim volume and slowly increased the elements.
    I then repeated at a quiet then Loud volume and then repeated it again.

    I have been quite surprised how much better it sounded than my attempt before. I dont know other peoples sequence of events when mixing but this seemed to work ok for me.
    i any comments or improvements to this workflow welcome its all a learning process after all!

    One question i do have is: does it really matter if you mix to 0db? I know mastering houses want headroom. But what the difference if the receive a file at 0 db and then turn it down 3db on the master then they have some headroom? no? Or am I missing understanding something fundamental about the digital domain?
     
  17. metafiziq

    metafiziq METAFIZIQ Recordings

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    Its good during the mixing to keep the level -6db -3db wihtout any clip, like this after at the mastering you can use EQ, compressor and limiter to pump the sound up, usualy after the mastering process my wavs are going at -0.2 , -0.4 db level. Always is good to have a small headroom bec sometimes when your doing live dj mixing you will have much space for the double drops.
     
  18. Krispy

    Krispy Member

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    I sent a tune to get mastered and the engineer told me my mixdown needs alot of work. I should try listening to my song on a bunch of different sets of speakers to see what it sounds like and I should try listening to it on a really good set of monitors. It really does pay to have GOOD speakers/monitors. These computer speakers and headphones just aren't cutting it anymore. He wouldn't even master the track for me because he said there was no point, it would only make it louder.

    At least he was honest with me is what I say