Fullness of sound reverb and layering.

Discussion in 'Production' started by IV4, May 28, 2014.

  1. IV4

    IV4 Currently a newt.

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2010
    Messages:
    5,158
    Likes Received:
    1,417
    So recently someone maid a post about how to get that "full" sound one finds in professional music. We then talked about eqing and layering and all that typical jazz, but with no real detail.
    Anyway, back when I did the blu mar ten remix I noticed that the stems where nothing amazing. But the stems themselves, like the "whale pitch", or "frets", had this amazing quality about them. They were not overly loud and had that "full" sound. It was reverb, delay, stereo panning, and layering. Much of what was going on was subtle and got lost in the grand scheme of the mix. But all that subtle texture really filled out the original blu mar ten song and took a somewhat boring bass line and reece bass with a boring break and turned it into a great song.

    I also downloaded stems for a remix contest for some pop-musician called mdnr. I won't lie I hate the original track. It sounds like every other pop song on the radio. But a couple a days ago I started to play with some of the stems. At first glance they do not seem like anything special. Until I started pulling them apart and really listening to them. They are in reality expertly constructed. Reverb, delay, and stereo panning used at precisely the right moment to accent the song in a flowing motion. When I listen to the vocal stem I noticed the same thing.

    All of these stems and my topic are non-bass related, but I found when I started fucking with four bar loops with my own basses something happen. They really brought out and complimented my most basic bass designs. With ease I was making basses sound fuller and more relevant.

    Since then I have been listening to many tracks in a new light and the more I listen the more I am starting to agree with myself. Am I on to something hear? What is your opinion.

    Also does anybody have any good and detailed suggestions for layering songs not with loud leads and basses but with well constructed mid to high frequency layers? If so how do you build your layers.

    I going to try and bait one the Dexcel guys into this topic and use one of there songs as an example. Listen.


    So in the first twenty seconds there is almost a broken glass sound that seems to be accented by a distortion that sounds like a broken record. I can hear a little bell and when I here it, the bell has a space and presence to it I could not emulate. There is a basic piano rift, and strings that gradually introduce themselves. To end it all a subtle chime comes it to introduce the vocal. Nothing about that should be that difficult. But everything is perfect and full. It is not just the melody but the texture that instantly says professional. Hell when the introduction vocal comes in the ride is so fucking perfect. I have tried for yeas to make a ride sound that well but I simply can not. What is it that they are doing that is not just a notch but well above the average skill set.
     
  2. Mania

    Mania i fukin wot m8

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2013
    Messages:
    1,524
    Likes Received:
    412
    Location:
    Melbourne, Victoria, AUS
    you kinda answered your own question there. as you said, light reverb, delays, panning layering. Also, like with the ride, the right samples.
    Work at at a high volume when applying those things, so you can hear as much detail as you can an hear the difference it makes better
     
  3. RUSSLA

    RUSSLA DNBF Monarch

    Joined:
    May 23, 2008
    Messages:
    6,264
    Likes Received:
    884
    Location:
    BH1
    Couldn't agree more. I always listen to new elements loud and quietly to hear the details. Stuff just sounds different loud.
     
  4. IV4

    IV4 Currently a newt.

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2010
    Messages:
    5,158
    Likes Received:
    1,417
    Good advice, but I certainly did not answer my own question. The devil is in the details and I want to know what are the details not the basics.

    - - - Updated - - -

    More detail please? It does sound different loud. How does that effect milliseconds of your delay? Does any reverb plug in you have seem to be more consistent than others? Have you ever processed a sound bounced it into a sampler as midi then used a pitch wheel on the reverb parts?
    Do you see where I am getting at?

    We can all slap reverb on what are better ways to do it.
     
  5. RUSSLA

    RUSSLA DNBF Monarch

    Joined:
    May 23, 2008
    Messages:
    6,264
    Likes Received:
    884
    Location:
    BH1
    1) No idea
    2) EOS Everyday
    3) No, but pitched Reverb busses are ace for ambient stuff.
    4) Yes
     
  6. Mania

    Mania i fukin wot m8

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2013
    Messages:
    1,524
    Likes Received:
    412
    Location:
    Melbourne, Victoria, AUS
    get the right verb for the job i guess
     
  7. sam the dnb man

    sam the dnb man Variation

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    10,437
    Likes Received:
    562
    Location:
    Feltham
    Smartelectronics Ambience. I great reverb that works well in mono too.
     
  8. Sammy Dexcell

    Sammy Dexcell Stop editing my profile Smarty!

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2004
    Messages:
    2,091
    Likes Received:
    115
    Location:
    A place where the flowers grow
    Bastard!! I can't not help once you post one of our tracks lol!

    Yeah you're on the right path man. It's really easy to look too deep into any aspect of music production. But to put you at ease, in this particular case, its pretty much some Vinyl rip loop of static + a Wood Fire or maybe raindrops loop and some wind chimes, all separately spaced, eq'd/transient shaped and then reverbed with different size amounts on the ones that need certain space etc it's everything you've mentioned really.
    Obviously, if something is particularly clicky you dont really want it in a huge reverb. Sticking the wet right up and having the size down with the a bit of decay creates that 'tight room' effect. With the right samples it works well. Same with the opposite of having stuff in huge reverbs. Stuff that's not clicky like vocals you can turn them into pads. It will give them a big amount of space in the mix. Lil tricks like that just help with the overall sound of the track, gives it the illusion that its bigger than it seems. Subtlety is key though. (y) Another thing we hardly use any special reverbs its pretty much reverb 2 in FL for most things.

    As for the mixing stage, we mix really loud and quite also, depends at what stage we're at with the tune or what were working on.
    Have recently been sticking a filter on the master and just running through it with a high pass or band or low just to double check everywhere is clean and nothings muddy'ing over stuff.
    Needless to say mixdowns are a bit of a mission sometimes!
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2014
    IV4 likes this.